“If George Carlin was alive right now and doing a podcast,” asks comic and podcaster Laurie Kilmartin of “The Jackie and Laurie Show,” “would he have Trump on it? Would Trump want to appear on it? I think no to both.”
Following Joe Biden’s April appearance on “SmartLess” with Jason Bateman, Sean Hayes and Will Arnett, in recent months Republican nominee Donald Trump eschewed “60 Minutes” and traditional interview outlets en route to Nov. 5’s presidential election. Where Kamala Harris has appeared on more traditional, issue-focused shows with women and Black listeners, Trump has preferred “Bro Vote” podcasts including comedy fare such as “This Past Weekend With Theo Von,” Andrew Schulz’s “Flagrant” and “The Joe Rogan Experience,” which aired Friday. “Kill Tony” host Tony Hinchcliffe received media criticism Sunday after calling Puerto Rico a “floating island of garbage” during a Trump rally at Madison Square Garden. (Schulz’s next special, slated to film at the Brooklyn Academy of Music in November, subsequently was pulled by the venue.)
In today’s stand-up comedy scene, a booming industry embracing a gamut of personalities and viewpoints, does speaking truth to power remain part of the job description? With election cycles increasingly confusing politics with entertainment, comedians who spoke with The Times say they increasingly contemplate how their societal roles have changed. Especially when peers’ promotional choices can directly affect outcomes.
“It’s really surreal to watch comedy elevated in this way, in a way that it shouldn’t be,” Kilmartin says. “I think we’re supposed to be the ones making politicians uncomfortable, not comfortable. I never liked it when presidents appeared on ‘SNL’ with the comics that were impersonating them. They should be running away from you. Not cozying up to you. And the ones that do push back, Trump’s not going on.”
“Hacks” writer and recent Emmy winner Guy Branum concurs. “He doesn’t want to be asked the questions that I’m going to ask him. And he doesn’t want to be fact-checked the way that I would fact-check him.
“That said,” Branum continues, “in the very limited amount that I heard of the Rogan podcast, Rogan was asking him to provide foundations for the accusations he has made about the election being stolen, and I respected that. In 2016 there were conversations about not providing Trump with a platform because the idea was he wasn’t a serious contender. He was a personality mucking around in politics. But now we have to acknowledge that he is representative of something that 47% of America is willing to support, and we have to ask why. Do I think giving him softball interviews is useful? No. But I don’t think deplatforming him is an option now.”
Brendon Walsh of “The World Record Podcast” and a comic who has been a guest on “Kill Tony,” identifies as a libertarian. By going on comedy podcasts, Walsh says, Trump risks alienating two types of voters: voters who wouldn’t vote for him if their lives depended on it, and voters who don’t like those podcasts. “I haven’t listened to his appearance on any of these shows, but I bet the term ‘woke’ is used at least once on all of them,” Walsh says. “I wonder if there’s a Trump promo code for 30% off your next order of Alpha Brain.”
Walsh imagines the idea of Trump sitting across a table from him as surreal. “I wouldn’t talk politics with him, I’d just try to get him to let his hair down, literally, and do some freestyle raps with me, then we’d prank call his son Eric. Let’s make podcasts fun again!”
Some say the opportunity for creating apolitical humor with Trump as a guest feels viable. Others, such as “Full House” actress-turned comedian Jodie Sweetin, aren’t sold on the idea.
“I think Trump on these podcasts is like watching your stoner cousin — who is 35, alone but has roommates, with a strict gym schedule and still thinks fart jokes are hilarious — do an [Instagram] Live with your drunk racist grandpa after everyone has had too much to drink at a family funeral,” says Sweetin, who podcasts with fellow “Full House” cast member Andrea Barber. “I would rather sing the ‘Full House’ theme song endlessly on repeat for eternity than allow Trump to come on ‘How Rude, Tanneritos!’”
Andy Kindler, whose annual State of the Industry address at Just for Laughs Montreal roasted popular performers, representatives, deals and trends for decades, grew up in Queens. He remembers Trump calling for the execution of the Central Park Five and says his father, a gas and heating contractor who did business with Trump, never got paid for his services. “If you look at Trump now, you know that Trump will forever be seen as one of the most evil people in the history of the world,” Kindler says.
Kindler is wary of comedian podcasters providing their platforms to politicians. “They know there’s money in saying something’s wrong with being woke. … People listen to Joe Rogan, and they don’t vaccinate themselves. People have died listening to the lies. I don’t even know what you say about a company like Spotify. All they care about is the numbers of the people who listen to his show.”
“He’s reaching out to like-minded audiences,” says Marc Maron, host of podcast “WTF With Marc Maron” since 2009. Maron welcomed President Barack Obama to the show in 2015 but confirms, “We don’t do campaigning politicians.”
During Trump’s presidency, Maron and producer Brendan McDonald revisited their policy regarding current or future presidents: No vetting of questions, and “WTF” retained final edit. Not, Maron clarifies, that Trump would consider doing his show in the first place.
“Even if you’re a comic, when does it cross a line?” he asks. “They’re normalizing fascism when they have these guys on their show because the delivery system is a ‘comedy’ podcast.
“When you say, yes, you can be on my show and talk to my people and use my platform, even if you think it’s going to be a laugh — ‘I’m going to talk to Trump about cocaine! Me and Trump could talk about wrestling! — even if you think that it’s good for your show, it’s self-serving, it’s going to get you a bunch of new followers or make you some money, you’re still facilitating and helping a fascist,” says Maron. “No matter what you’re claiming to be, libertarians or apathetic or both-siders or ‘We’re just trying to get to the truth!’ you align yourself with a fascist.
“They’ve made it very clear, Trump and his minions, what they want, and it’s not democracy. It’s fundamentally un-American,” Maron adds. “There’s a point where it’s not funny anymore. This is not just another election. It’s really not.”
